By Andrea Tornielli
Cardinal Pietro Parolin visited Jordan this week. On Friday, he presided over the solemn liturgy for the dedication of the new church of the Latin Patriarchate of Jerusalem, built on the site of Jesus’ baptism. In a sign of vitality and hope, more than six thousand faithful attended, filling the church to such an extent many were unable to find a place inside.
After the celebration, Vatican News spoke with the Secretary of State about current world events, including the words addressed by Pope Francis to the Diplomatic Corps on Jan 9, 2025.
Following is the text of the interview
We are in Jordan, in the Holy Land, at the site of Jesus’ baptism, which until a few decades ago was a minefield. Not far from here, a war triggered by Hamas’s attacks is ongoing, causing death and destruction inflicted mainly on civilians, particularly in Gaza. What message would you like to convey?
Cardinal Parolin: It was a very beautiful and well-organized celebration, but above all, it was one of great hope. And it is not because hope has become a cliché during this Jubilee year dedicated to it. The message that emerges from this day, I believe, is this: in a region ravaged by so many conflicts, torn apart by so many tensions, this once-mined area is now a stretch of cultivated land. This is already, in itself, a sign of hope: as the prophet says, swords can indeed be turned into ploughshares, and weapons can become instruments of peace. The large and lively participation of people is also a reason for hope. There are vital forces, and Christianity can help, with God’s grace, to find paths to solve current conflicts.
Jordan is a nation where the Christian minority is integrated and feels part of the country. Unfortunately, this is not the case in other contexts. What is the role of Christians in the Middle East today?
Cardinal Parolin: Christians have been present in these countries since time immemorial and continue to be an integral and rightful part of Middle Eastern states and societies, even though past and recent events are encouraging them to emigrate. Consequently, the Christian communities in these countries are numerically shrinking. I would like to reaffirm this constitutive dimension of the Christian presence: Arab also means Christian because there is a Christian community rooted in the history of these lands. I would emphasize this fundamental and constitutive dimension of the Christian presence. Christians, as a constitutive part, can contribute in all fields. As the Pope has said many times, the Middle East without Christians would be poorer, lacking an essential expression of this region’s very identity.
Are you concerned about the evolution of the situation in Syria?
Cardinal Parolin: I have read the positive statements that have been made, which align with the direction hoped for by the Pope in his address to the Diplomatic Corps. We hope that a new era can begin for Syria, where all citizens will have the same rights and privileges. This is the concept of citizenship that the Holy See also proposes for all countries: all citizens are equal, with equal rights and equal duties before the law. We truly hope that these statements will be followed by actions, ensuring the protection of the rights of minorities and Christians as well.
Two days ago, after two years, the president of Lebanon was finally elected. How significant is this?
Cardinal Parolin: I believe it is a positive sign. Over the past two years, we have always maintained that it was crucial for the continuity and survival of the country as it is structured—that is, to use the famous phrase of Saint John Paul II, “a country that is a message”— a country where social, political, and religious diversity coexist. We have always emphasized that the priority was to secure the presidency, thereby strengthening the institutions. It is therefore a sign of hope. We sincerely hope that this election will mark a new phase for Lebanon, where all political forces come together to find common ground and work for the good of the country, particularly for the reforms the country so urgently needs.
Could you mention some of those reforms?
Cardinal Parolin: For example, providing justice to the victims and families affected by the Beirut port explosion, and restoring economic stability, which has been lost and has caused widespread poverty and suffering in the country. It is positive that they have managed to elect a president.
During his recent trips to Luxembourg and Belgium, referring to situations of war, Pope Francis called for “honest negotiations” and “honourable compromises.” Why has it become so difficult today to negotiate and reach a compromise? Why does diplomacy seem silent? I am particularly referring to the ongoing conflict in the heart of Christian Europe between Russia and Ukraine.
Cardinal Parolin: It is truly saddening that we seem to have lost the ability to negotiate and that, as they say, the force prevails over the rule of law. In his address to the Diplomatic Corps, Pope Francis referred to several causes of this situation, explaining that there is a climate of mistrust and mutual fear, which creates increasing polarization between states and communities and prevents the search for common solutions. I would particularly emphasize this point: there is a lack of basic trust. To negotiate and dialogue, there needs to be at least a minimal level of trust in the other party. Another aspect the Pope highlighted is the ability to see things from the perspective of the other party, who in this case is the enemy. There needs to be a willingness to meet halfway, to understand or at least seriously consider the reasons of the other side. These are the reasons why negotiating has become so difficult today. Added to this—also mentioned by the Pope—is the crisis of institutions that were established to foster dialogue, such as international organizations. Today, these institutions struggle to continue fulfilling the role they successfully played immediately after World War II. There are many other causes, but I believe this is at the root of it all.
In his address to the Diplomatic Corps, the Pope denounced the risk of what he termed as a “club mentality,” which leads to choosing dialogue only with those who already share our views. Pope Francis has often invoked the “spirit of Helsinki”, what could that mean today?
Cardinal Parolin: The spirit of Helsinki is precisely about overcoming this mentality. We lived in a divided world, a world of opposition, split into two blocs. Perhaps today these “clubs” have fragmented and multiplied. In a certain sense, it might even have been easier when there were only two blocs. The spirit of Helsinki represents the effort to move beyond the idea of an enemy, finding common ground even with those who do not share the same views. Helsinki symbolizes the ability to transcend one’s perspective or to not regard it as the only exclusive one, accepting that other legitimate viewpoints exist and can be reconciled with one’s own, albeit by giving something up. This is the essence of a healthy compromise. Another key aspect of negotiation should be the willingness to seek compromise to overcome conflict.
In this context, what does the expression “just peace” mean?
Cardinal Parolin: In my view, a “just peace” means peace founded on international law and the declarations of the United Nations. These are the tools the international community has at its disposal to regulate relations among countries and between communities of states. From a Christian perspective, we understand justice in its various facets, but fundamentally, I would say “just peace” refers to peace that aligns with international law and its rules.
John Paul II wrote that there can be no peace without justice, and no justice without forgiveness…
Cardinal Parolin: In Christian thought, justice is not merely giving each person their due according to distributive justice, but it is a justice that Jesus Himself evokes—a higher form of justice that becomes love and forgiveness toward others. In his address to the Diplomatic Corps, Pope Francis spoke about the diplomacy of forgiveness. That passage was particularly beautiful because it highlights the ability to go beyond the mere demands of justice.
The Provisional Agreement on the appointment of new bishops in China continues to be the subject of controversy, raised both in international-political and ecclesial circles. Some see it as a sign of weakness. What is its deeper meaning?
Cardinal Parolin: It is logical for differing opinions to arise in the face of a situation as complex as the one in China, which stems from a particularly difficult history. Opinions can vary greatly, and I have always said that I am not shocked by differing views, as some may believe: other solutions exist. The Holy See deemed this agreement to be the most effective solution to begin a dialogue with one of the key issues on the table. One of the most significant and challenging issues was the appointment of bishops. I believe the agreement on bishops’ appointments seeks to achieve two fundamental things, progressing slowly—sometimes even taking a step backwards—but moving in the right direction. The first is ensuring that all bishops are in communion with the Pope. This is fundamental for the Catholic Church. The second is the attempt—though not always successful—to foster unity within the Church, overcoming divisions and ensuring some degree of normalization in its life. There is no “magic” solution, but the agreement represents a journey—a slow and challenging journey that, in my opinion, is beginning to bear some fruit. These fruits might not yet be visible, but they will likely become more evident as trust and the ability to engage in dialogue between the parties grow.
During his meeting with the media on the return flight from Singapore, Pope Francis described the results of the dialogue with the Chinese government as “good,” saying that “even regarding the appointment of bishops…” So, there is reason to hope in this case too…
Cardinal Parolin: I believe so; there is reason to hope. In his address to the Diplomatic Corps, the Pope spoke about the diplomacy of patience. I think this is a case where more than in others—but perhaps in general—we must develop the capacity for patience, as the Apostle James encourages us: consider the farmer who sows the seed and then patiently waits for the rains, for the snow, and for the seed to bear fruit. I believe that even in this area, as in many others in life, we need this ability to look beyond immediate results. Unfortunately, we are also slaves to immediacy. I think that many of the reactions you mentioned stem from this flattening of perspective on the present, the lack of ability to take a long-term view toward the future while also considering the past and the difficulties experienced in the past. So, without fostering false illusions—because I think no one is under any illusions in this regard—we can move forward with hope and commitment, trusting that, with God’s grace, this path will yield the desired fruits. – Vatican News
